THE INTREPIDS & THE INSTITUTION WEBPAGE

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 6:39 pm 
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Strength of Will is actually going to be an interesting one....

Don't ask me how... but they have apparently made it immune to recharge adjustment effects (so hasten, AM, SB etc don't affect it). I guess we might be looking at a number of other powers, especially those top tier powers, going the same way.

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@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 6:40 pm 
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well your right abourt ToF its a hit for hit type thing tho in PvE some enimes react diferently to it.

Blast i notice your compareing a spinse regen to a dark regen but then go on to talk about ToF vs Intimidate. its inportant to remember that Intimidate is not a spines power its open to all including the dark/regen so the dark regen could fear from a distance and move in with more fear from ToF and if you wanted to be really evil you could slot eatch with the "chance of psi damage" it mite take a while but you could wittle down your oponents health.

Or a favered tatic from my time playing Tos

ToF followed by Air Sup reapeated over and over for anything without knockdown resistance its gona be a easy kill (worked wonders on bosses and some EBs) chuck in another attake maybe dark grasp just for veriety

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:09 pm 
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I'm not comparing DM vs Spines Mess, I'm comparing a scrapper with only melee damage attacks and melee fear vs. a scrapper with ranged attacks (ie Spines & Claws) with ranged Fear (Intimidate). See what I just said in my previous post:

Quote:
I just compared ToF with Intimidate mate, and I still believe a scrapper with ranged attacks (not only Spines, Claws also has a ranged attack) with ranged fear will be more effective compared with a melee scrapper with melee fear. ToF might recharge faster but your opponent is not a light post, you'll need to get near him, while it's not impossible it'll take time as the compensation of Intimidate's longer recharge rate :)...


And thank you for reminding me that Intimidate is not just for Spines scrappers :)...

X, as for the decision between SR and Regen sets, ofcourse its your decision at the end mate. We also had similar discussion with Mono many times about whose scrapper was better (my regen or his SR). It really depends on the environment. Ok, my scrapper is a non-stop AoE killing machine in PvE against many enemy types but one hit from a malta sapper and I'm dead instantly, because whatever is launched definitively hits me, but not the same thing for a SR.

Or if it's one on one PvP, ok, a regen is still better against melee fighters but SRs are far superiour, in my opinion, against mezzers like controllers, defenders, dominators etc..., which represent the majority in PvP.

As for Will Power, we just have to wait and see...

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@blastor-eu

The Intrepids:
Blastor-Level 50 Energy/Fire/Electrical Blaster, Dr. Blast-Level 50 Robotics/Force Field/Mace Mastermind, Holy Blast-Level 50 Peacebringer, Blasting Spines-Level 50 Spines/Regeneration/Body Scrapper, Heatblast-Level 50 Invulnerability/Fiery/Pyre Tanker, Fire Blast-Level 50 Fire/Kinetics/Leviathan Corruptor, Thunder Steel-Level 50 Ninja/Ninjitsu/Mu Stalker, Israfel the Fallen-Level 50 Sonic/Thermal/Dark Corruptor, Blastor Ascended-Level 50 Psychic/Energy/Force Blaster, Fright-Level 50 Kinetic/Dark Armour/Energy Brute, Calibro-Level 50 Dual Pistols/Radiation/Power Corruptor, Nlidia-Level 50 Gravity/Storm/Ice Controller.

The Institution:
Admiral Blast-Level 50 Energy/Energy/Mace Brute, Darkest Blast-Level 50 Mind/Psionic/Leviathan Dominator, Arbiter Blast-Level 50 Crab/Mace Arachnos Soldier, Unmerciful Steel-Level 50 Dual Blades/Willpower/Soul Brute, Mind Blaster-Level 50 Dark Miasma/Psychic/Psychic Defender, Blastor Reborn-Level 50 Ice/Electric/Force Blaster, Superiora-Level 50 Invulnerability/Super Strength/Energy Tanker, Gaia Queen-Level 50 Plant/Empathy/Stone Controller, Shadow Seer-Level 50 Fortunata/Soul Arachnos Widow, Zamana-Level 50 Time/Beam Rifle Defender, Wild Raven-Level 50 Will Power/Street Justice/Energy Tanker, Nlador-Level 50 Titan/Fiery Brute.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:11 pm 
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Well that's weird...
Don Ebon wrote:
Don't ask me how... but they have apparently made it immune to recharge adjustment effects (so hasten, AM, SB etc don't affect it).

as Mid's latest update (today's) is definitely showing Aegis and Titanium Coating for recipes which include full -recharge capabilities (and with Aegis a "mag 20%" MeZrest to just about everything for the full set!). Not sure if that's mag 20 which would be amazing and makes sense although 20% resistance improvement seems more likely. Anyone know what that means (on Mids)?

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:15 pm 
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Blast wrote:
Or if it's one on one PvP, ok, a regen is still better against melee fighters but SRs are far superiour, in my opinion, against mezzers like controllers, defenders, dominators etc..., which represent the majority in PvP.

That's a goodpoint well made mate. Although DM does also have more problems to throw at the contoller/defender types that the simple 'oh shit - I can't hit him' problem presented by an SR.

I like your ToF/Air Supp idea too Mess. Very amusing too.

EDIT: So maybe you're right Blast. Maybe I should be experimenting with DM/SR. That would need 3 accounts though!

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:56 pm 
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Been browsing official forum threads about stealth/perception earlier and I'd also like to add that SR is the only scrapper set which surpasses the stealth cap (from level 41 with Focussed Accuracy) allowing to see stalkers with full stealth (Hide+Stealth+Stealth IO) without any buff from teammates.

Here's the math:

Recluse's Victory: (Level 50, Cap of 1153 feet)

500 (Normal Base Perception)
242.2 (Tactics @50)
300 (Focussed Senses)
300 (Focussed Accuracy)
= 1342.2 Feet.


For low level PvP zones, to compensate the perception buff from Focused Accuracy, empowerment buff combined with +perception IO (New I11 set IO from Rectified Reticle) is needed...

Here' the link.

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@blastor-eu

The Intrepids:
Blastor-Level 50 Energy/Fire/Electrical Blaster, Dr. Blast-Level 50 Robotics/Force Field/Mace Mastermind, Holy Blast-Level 50 Peacebringer, Blasting Spines-Level 50 Spines/Regeneration/Body Scrapper, Heatblast-Level 50 Invulnerability/Fiery/Pyre Tanker, Fire Blast-Level 50 Fire/Kinetics/Leviathan Corruptor, Thunder Steel-Level 50 Ninja/Ninjitsu/Mu Stalker, Israfel the Fallen-Level 50 Sonic/Thermal/Dark Corruptor, Blastor Ascended-Level 50 Psychic/Energy/Force Blaster, Fright-Level 50 Kinetic/Dark Armour/Energy Brute, Calibro-Level 50 Dual Pistols/Radiation/Power Corruptor, Nlidia-Level 50 Gravity/Storm/Ice Controller.

The Institution:
Admiral Blast-Level 50 Energy/Energy/Mace Brute, Darkest Blast-Level 50 Mind/Psionic/Leviathan Dominator, Arbiter Blast-Level 50 Crab/Mace Arachnos Soldier, Unmerciful Steel-Level 50 Dual Blades/Willpower/Soul Brute, Mind Blaster-Level 50 Dark Miasma/Psychic/Psychic Defender, Blastor Reborn-Level 50 Ice/Electric/Force Blaster, Superiora-Level 50 Invulnerability/Super Strength/Energy Tanker, Gaia Queen-Level 50 Plant/Empathy/Stone Controller, Shadow Seer-Level 50 Fortunata/Soul Arachnos Widow, Zamana-Level 50 Time/Beam Rifle Defender, Wild Raven-Level 50 Will Power/Street Justice/Energy Tanker, Nlador-Level 50 Titan/Fiery Brute.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:09 pm 
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Oooo. Nice find Blast. I'll get back to that perception thread with now. I still don't see how distance has anything to do with short-range perception. :?

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:49 pm 
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Stop trying to apply common sense and logic to a game-world X :wink:

They have to make some conpromises for functionality. It makes a basic kind of sense to me.... stealth reduces the separation at which you can see somebody... perception increases it.

The real problem is that the game is scaled very differently for powers vs visuals. The baseline distance at which a player can 'see' a threat is 500 yrds. But even a snipe attack (the longest range attacks in the game) only have a base range of 100 yrds (roughly). Essentially you can see 5 times further than you can attack.. at least!

Because view distances are large, small changes (proportionately) in those are huge in proportion to attack ranges. eg using just stealth the base perception of a player is such that they can see you at double snipes range! All they need is a nominal +perception and they are good to go.

It seems to me that the bottom line of the system is, don't expect to trivially be able to sneak up on somebody who has any real level of +percept.

_________________
@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:15 pm 
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One correction though...

Will Power also has +perception power called "Heightened Senses", I assume that it'll have the same amount of buff compared with Focused Senses. The only difference is that HS is a level 28 power while FS is level 2.

So Will Power won't be effective in Bloody Bay, but other PvP zones are probably fine...

_________________
@blastor-eu

The Intrepids:
Blastor-Level 50 Energy/Fire/Electrical Blaster, Dr. Blast-Level 50 Robotics/Force Field/Mace Mastermind, Holy Blast-Level 50 Peacebringer, Blasting Spines-Level 50 Spines/Regeneration/Body Scrapper, Heatblast-Level 50 Invulnerability/Fiery/Pyre Tanker, Fire Blast-Level 50 Fire/Kinetics/Leviathan Corruptor, Thunder Steel-Level 50 Ninja/Ninjitsu/Mu Stalker, Israfel the Fallen-Level 50 Sonic/Thermal/Dark Corruptor, Blastor Ascended-Level 50 Psychic/Energy/Force Blaster, Fright-Level 50 Kinetic/Dark Armour/Energy Brute, Calibro-Level 50 Dual Pistols/Radiation/Power Corruptor, Nlidia-Level 50 Gravity/Storm/Ice Controller.

The Institution:
Admiral Blast-Level 50 Energy/Energy/Mace Brute, Darkest Blast-Level 50 Mind/Psionic/Leviathan Dominator, Arbiter Blast-Level 50 Crab/Mace Arachnos Soldier, Unmerciful Steel-Level 50 Dual Blades/Willpower/Soul Brute, Mind Blaster-Level 50 Dark Miasma/Psychic/Psychic Defender, Blastor Reborn-Level 50 Ice/Electric/Force Blaster, Superiora-Level 50 Invulnerability/Super Strength/Energy Tanker, Gaia Queen-Level 50 Plant/Empathy/Stone Controller, Shadow Seer-Level 50 Fortunata/Soul Arachnos Widow, Zamana-Level 50 Time/Beam Rifle Defender, Wild Raven-Level 50 Will Power/Street Justice/Energy Tanker, Nlador-Level 50 Titan/Fiery Brute.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:31 pm 
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I agree Ebo ....
Ebo wrote:
They have to make some conpromises for functionality. It makes a basic kind of sense to me.... stealth reduces the separation at which you can see somebody... perception increases it.

... except surely they have this the wrong way round. Wrong thread reply by the way.

Perception should be related to proximity not distance. So the finest stalkers/assasins should have the ability to get closest to the target without being seen and vice versa. Someone without any stealth ability (nb. most toons) should only be 'seen' from a longer distance away. So an increase in perception should allow peeps to increasingly see mobs as they get nearer to them. Not further away. That's of no relavance to anyone or anything.

Likewise an increase in perception should extend the distance out from which you can see mobs/toons out from zero to whatever and so a 20% boost to perception might be better off as a 20ft increase (or whatever). True invisibility should be 0 feet, stealth should be 10-15ft or whatever and to work in the same way that all the other powers work Invisbility and perception should be allowed to be negative so a toon with 0 perception should only be able to see someone 0 feet away (when they're been hit). Someone (a stalker say) should be allowed to have a negative value (of -20ft say) so that the use of Tactics (or whatever) should increase that distance out to 10 ft again (or whatever). That isn't what is happening in the game, so far as I can see. No pun intended.

This thread will be back on track again shortly. Build proposal to follow.

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:07 pm 
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MrX wrote:
Perception should be related to proximity not distance. ... So an increase in perception should allow peeps to increasingly see mobs as they get nearer to them. Not further away. That's of no relavance to anyone or anything.

Likewise an increase in perception should extend the distance out from which you can see mobs/toons out from zero to whatever...


erm... those two comments seem to be mutually exclusive. Either perception should extend out the distance you see things or it shouldn't....

Remember that Stealth and Perception are antagonistic characteristics... just like Defence and ToHit are. It's pretty pointless to think about either of them in isolation.. you have to think about them in pairs.

MrX wrote:
True invisibility should be 0 feet, stealth should be 10-15ft or whatever and to work in the same way that all the other powers work Invisbility and perception should be allowed to be negative so a toon with 0 perception should only be able to see someone 0 feet away (when they're been hit).

Perception certainly can be negative.... smoke grenade for example has a -450 percept effect. Stack two of those on somebody and their perception (assuming no +percept powers) is now -400.

MrX wrote:
Someone (a stalker say) should be allowed to have a negative value (of -20ft say) so that the use of Tactics (or whatever) should increase that distance out to 10 ft again (or whatever). That isn't what is happening in the game, so far as I can see. No pun intended.


Again, I think you're missing the point where Stealth and Perception are an antagonistic pair. The distance at which you can see person X (pun fully intended :wink:) is your Percept - X's Stealth. If X's Stealth > Your Percept, then that figure is negative.

The only real problem with the system is that the base perception is so high for players (500) that it's tough to beat, seeing as there are plenty of powers out there that will bump that by a good couple hundred. Really they should probably tone that 500 down to more like 200....... except then everybody would moan that they always get ganked in PvP zones by people they can't see.

It's basically balanced so you have to work damned hard to be able to creep up on anybody in PvP.. because if it isn't, everybody will do it and you could have a PvP zone full of people who never find each other :shock:

And who wants threads on track :D

_________________
@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 8:02 pm 
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Ebo dude. I think you're missing my point. Not saying it's your fault just that you are. It basically boils down to this: Invisibility and (Granted Invisbility and so on) should NOT be detectable using standard powers like Tactics UNLESS the mob/toon was close enough to perceive them (somehow). Period.

At the moment, the game doesn't work like that. Any old baffoon using Tactics (or similar power) can see an Invisibled toon equally as well a stealthed toon regardless of distance. That's all wrong. Period.

If this is a question of look-up tables (or mag levels, or whatever you want to call them) then what I'm saying is that these values are all wrong.

Invisibility should mean something. It shouldn't be just as easy to spot an invisibled toon as a stealthed toon. That's where the whole system is wrong. I think the whole stalker/stealth thing is working fine and all the other relative perception/stealth are more or less ok but it is just too easy to spot someone with Invisibility on and that's wrong. There is no use for that power any more and there should be.

Name me one toon of yours or one toon you're seen since CoV was introduced who has taken Invisibility. The only use I can think of, as I mentioned earlier, is for a stalker who wants to sit invisibly in a corner until he wants to move and strike again (when he will obviously need to detoggle it).

That's my point dude.

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 10:30 pm 
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OK...

see the way I see it is that Invisibility is still plenty useful in PvE. If they made it have the same kind of potency in PvP I can tell you how things would play out...


every PvP build would include Invis...
whenever you went into a PvP zone you'd seem to be all alone...


Bottom line is it is easier to see a stealthed toon vs an invis'd one. Invis gives you approx double the +stealth that Stealth (the power) does. The problem is that the perception values are all so high that it makes no real difference in game terms, because relative to attack ranges, the differences aren't important... and they should be. But you will be able to see the Stealthed toon from further away (hardware and graphical settings permitting :wink:)


So.. YAY... I think we're agreed that the +perception numbers are off and need adjusting (or Invis needs to have a much higher +stealth)

The problem is that to be honest... stealth is a stupid thing to put in. It's nigh on impossible to balance, as it's a binary thing... either I can see you or I can't.... and if I can't in a PvP environment I'm in serious trouble.

_________________
@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:11 am 
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I read the first few posts, but then got bored. Since I didn't read all I should probably not speak up. Anyhow.. here's how I would think if I were a dev: "If we give this power set more mitigation, or control or other non-direct damaging effects, then we need to reduce the outgoing damage of the set."

How does that apply to the dark/regen? Well, since dark has fear and other niftyness, it shouldn't be able to do as much direct damage, as a pure damage primary. Hence, the more you want to increase your mitigation, and become more durable, the less you'll be able to hurt things. Basically, the dark/regen will be more tanker-like, than your broadsword/regen (that's what the messenger, is, right?) who is more dps-oriented.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:32 am 
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Yep Glad. That's The Messenger all over. Although Dark is supposed to be similar to Claws in delivery the highest DPS over time. Whereas my broadsword does spectaular single-hit damage but at less regular intervals. In PVP or against a high lvl boss/villain I guess you could argue that consistent DPS over time is what you'd prefer - although nothing is quite as satisfying to me as popping Build Up then watch Headsplitter land a critical and one-hit kill a red leuitenant. That's what I call fun. :D

Build still to follow.

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[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:54 pm 
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Yeah... DM is more of a wear them down set I think. In principle it's got good damage (Shadow Maul for example is huge).. but it just doesn't have very many primary attack powers... there are so many utility powers mixed in there.

And I think Glad, you hit the nail squarely there. DM has a lot of tricks up it's sleeves, losing raw damage output in the process.

Certainly against high level PvE, especially AV's, good sustained DPS is definitely what you want.... but arguably for PvP you want front loaded burst damage. The longer you take to wear them down the (potentially) more options you give your opponent.

I've often considered a DM/Regen.... but always in the end decided that I thought a DM/SR would be more fun. DM/Regen I think is just going to be a bit... too durable.... for exciting play... but of course YMMV.

_________________
@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:38 pm 
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And here's that build plan and notes:

Your first few powers (should pick themselves):

01) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(1) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(15)
01) --> Fast Healing==> Heal(1) Heal(46) Heal(46)
02) --> Smite==> Acc(2) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(13) Rechg(19)
04) --> Quick Recovery==> EndMod(4) EndMod(15) EndMod(19)

The feint of heart might prefer to take Reconstruction early but as soon as you get Touch of Fear you don't really need it.

06) --> Touch of Fear==> Acc(6) Acc(11) TH_DeBuf(40) TH_DeBuf(40) Rechg(42)
08 ) --> Shadow Maul==> Acc(8 ) Acc(9) Dmg(9) Dmg(11) Dmg(13) Rechg(17)
10) --> Dull Pain==> Heal(10) Heal(23) Heal(25) Rechg(31) Rechg(36) Rechg(43)

Here I thought about taking Siphon Life instead of Dull Pain. At the early levels you don't really need Dull Pain and while your attack chain is still slow (pre SO'd Hasten and -recharge SO's) I figure you may as well have another damage power (Siphon Life) that happens to give a bit back (10% heal every 15 seconds). You're never in danger before lvl 12 upwards anyway so the amazing power that is Dull Pain could be taken later. For you numbers freaks (like me) Siphon Life generates nearly twice the heal that Reconstruction does over a 60 second period while also doing damage and debuffing accuracy - which is the main reason I've left Reconstruction out entirely. I've seen others argue that you don't need Siphon Life if you're regen - in which case you would think you don't need Reconstruction either. More on this later when we look at Moment of Glory.

With Touch of Fear used as a soft (but excellent, control power) and big-hitter accuracy debuffer, and Shadow Maul knocking minions down to size in rapid time, it's time to filling out the early powers and getting the slots in the right order for the more interesting powers coming up:

12) --> Hasten==> Rechg(12) Rechg(21) Rechg(23)
14) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Integration==> Heal(16) Heal(17) Heal(21)

Your 'Girls Best Friend' here is Integration. A wonderful power that provides status protection and a great heal recovery rate. I would normally expect to moving off heroic status sometime before now but plan to be knocking over mobs just as fast as possible before slotting up Hasten and Dull Pain with SO's from lvl 22 with a view to getting Dull Pain up as much as possible and to start taking on the big red and purple guys. I would solo with scrapper as much as do team work (occupational hazard) and so good solo play and potentialy good PVP play (or at least fun) is what i always have in mind. Of course Integration works on your boosted health level (care of Dull Pain) in the same way that Instant Healing does later on. Note to myself: I presume Reconstruction provides percentage heal to your boosted current health level and I wander if Siphon Life does too? If anyone knows the answer to that I'd be grateful. It might change my rollout plan.

18 ) --> Hurdle==> Jump(18 )
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22) EndMod(42) EndMod(46)

Some, but not many, would say that you could get away without Stamina (and all the fitness pool set) and rely on Dark Consumption (an end-drainer available from lvl 18) and Quick Recovery (which is a bit stronger than Stamina anyway). The pros and cons to that are that not taking the fitness pool saves a whole pool, three new powers and between 4-6 slots Nothing to be sneezed at. On the other hand Quick Recovery will NOT be enough on it's own and you will need to rely on Dark Consumption. Dark Consumption needs a hit and you need to within 8ft of the target/s when you hit them - which you can't rely on. DC is also only available on a 180 second recharge! So if you miss once you could really be up a gum tree. Other reasons for including stamina and DC, my reasons, are that you can take more toggles, you can go toe to toe with the big bad guys a lot longer and you have one less thing to worry about when facing other end-drainers. Having played two other regens and a high-lvl dark brute I can tell you: Dark Consumption comes in mighty handy. It also does a nice line of extra AEO damage. With this particular toon, the uber-toon, I do plan to take two big end hogs Tough and Weave as well as Focused Accuracy while maintaining maximum damage output. A standard regen can't sustain that - not without diluting the damage output with -end mods. So the name of the game here, with this toon plan, is sustainable damage output, accuracy, accuracy debuffing and endurance sustainability.

24) --> Siphon Life==> Acc(24) Acc(25) Heal(29) Heal(29) Dmg(31) Rechg(34)
26) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(26) Acc(27) Rechg(27) Rechg(37) TH_Buf(50) TH_Buf(50)
28 ) --> Instant Healing==> Heal(28 ) Heal(31) Heal(37) Rechg(37) Rechg(45)

Here you can see I've included the optional Siphon Life, for the reasons already mentioned. You could take Reconstruction instead or Dark Consumption. Soul Drain is one great power though and can't be missed either. It adds just a little extra damage and accurcy 1 on 1 (while damaging just a little) but the damage and accuracy buff against a large mob will place this particular scrapper towards the top of damage dealing tables. The damage buff is 15% per mob. Get yourself in a big team and hit through a tightly packed mob with Shadow Maul (which is actually a narrow cone attack) and watch the whole lot that were standing in front of you, fall over and disappear. The amazing Instant Healing puts you in God Mode for 90 seconds but with my other two regens I very rarely need IH and usually just for purple boss take downs. With my Dark Melee shots and Touch of Fear debuffing these guys even more I really think we'll be in for a very comfortable ride against most purple bosses (+3 lvl) and the damage rate on these toons should be almost as good as it gets - especially when you stopto remember that the damage type is largely negative energy instead of the usual lethal/smashing stuff that all the other scrappers will have (including those swanky new Duel-Blade dudes).

30) --> Boxing==> Acc(30)
32) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(32) Acc(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(34) Rechg(34)
35) --> Tough==> DmgRes(35) DmgRes(36) DmgRes(36)
38 ) --> Dark Consumption==> Acc(38 ) Acc(39) Rechg(39) Rechg(39) EndMod(40) EndMod(43)

Many, many folks will also tell you that taking Tough and Weave is over the top and also not sustainable. I agree. But the plan here is for the uber-toon not your average-toon. I don't yet know if DC will enable me to maintain all these and Focused Accuracy. Time will tell and I may have to conceed and use the slots on something else or take Conserve Power and drop Moment of Glory (see below). Not sure yet.

41) --> Focused Accuracy==> TH_Buf(41) TH_Buf(42) TH_Buf(43)
44) --> Weave==> DefBuf(44) DefBuf(45) DefBuf(45)
47) --> Moment Of Glory==> DmgRes(47) DmgRes(48 ) DmgRes(48 ) DefBuf(48 )
49) --> Resilience==> DmgRes(49) DmgRes(50)

To cap the uber-toon off I'll be taking Focused Accuracy for sure. You rarely fail to hit anything with that running and I may or may not take Moment of Glory. MoG is oneof those powers that the first few times you use you feel like God (again) but, for the un-initiated, I've died more times using MoG than not. It's of no use at all against Psi damage and more often that not your reduced health level will dwindle towards zero (through occassional glancing blows) and you'll be stuck wandering around waiting for it to drop. It's a click. The power would be better fun it wasn't but there you go. On my other two regens I've either dropped MoG altogether or simply used the slots on Reconstruction instead - where I can tell you - Reconstruction is a lot more useful a lot more often than MoG. Let's face it you're hardly ever going to die anyway. :D


But for the uber-toon I've left MoG in.
Here's the whole build again:

01) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(1) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(15)
01) --> Fast Healing==> Heal(1) Heal(46) Heal(46)
02) --> Smite==> Acc(2) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(13) Rechg(19)
04) --> Quick Recovery==> EndMod(4) EndMod(15) EndMod(19)
06) --> Touch of Fear==> Acc(6) Acc(11) TH_DeBuf(40) TH_DeBuf(40) Rechg(42)
08 ) --> Shadow Maul==> Acc(8 ) Acc(9) Dmg(9) Dmg(11) Dmg(13) Rechg(17)
10) --> Dull Pain==> Heal(10) Heal(23) Heal(25) Rechg(31) Rechg(36) Rechg(43)
12) --> Hasten==> Rechg(12) Rechg(21) Rechg(23)
14) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Integration==> Heal(16) Heal(17) Heal(21)
18 ) --> Hurdle==> Jump(18 )
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22) EndMod(42) EndMod(46)
24) --> Siphon Life==> Acc(24) Acc(25) Heal(29) Heal(29) Dmg(31) Rechg(34)
26) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(26) Acc(27) Rechg(27) Rechg(37) TH_Buf(50) TH_Buf(50)
28 ) --> Instant Healing==> Heal(28 ) Heal(31) Heal(37) Rechg(37) Rechg(45)
30) --> Boxing==> Acc(30)
32) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(32) Acc(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(34) Rechg(34)
35) --> Tough==> DmgRes(35) DmgRes(36) DmgRes(36)
38 ) --> Dark Consumption==> Acc(38 ) Acc(39) Rechg(39) Rechg(39) EndMod(40) EndMod(43)
41) --> Focused Accuracy==> TH_Buf(41) TH_Buf(42) TH_Buf(43)
44) --> Weave==> DefBuf(44) DefBuf(45) DefBuf(45)
47) --> Moment Of Glory==> DmgRes(47) DmgRes(48 ) DmgRes(48 ) DefBuf(48 )
49) --> Resilience==> DmgRes(49) DmgRes(50)

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


Last edited by MrX on Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:56 pm 
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hmmm... I think it's a brave choice not taking reconstruction. It may well work out, and I can see where you're coming from re Siphon Life instead, but it needs to connect to give you that green number goodness.

I'll be intruiged to see how this works out. Also be interested to see how it fares vs a Willpower scrapper. Willpower get's almost Intregration levels of regen from a single foe via Rise to the Challenge (rising to almost IH levels with 10 opponents around you if Mids numbers are good!).. and status protection from Fear (which I think you're going to be relying on for some of that soft control and damage mitigation).

Willpower does suffer from not particularly great protection from NE damage though, but they can potentially top up with all the toggles you're looking to (although I personally think getting Tough and Weave into a WP scrappers build is tough work... especially a DB one where you need basically all the primary and all the secondary).

It looks an interesting build. Seems to me to be focused on durability.

_________________
@Ebon Hawk-EU or @Zenobia Blade

Official Chiefette Translator
----------------------------------
Intrepids
LOx lvl27 Tanker
Synaptic Pulse lvl25 Defender

Legends
Ebon Hawk (Claws/Regen Scrapper)
Girl Fusion (Empathy/Rad Blast Defender)
Zenobia Blade (Broadsword/Shield/Blaze Scrapper)
Pyrokyne (Fire/Kin/Mu Corruptor)
Blaize of Glory (Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster)
Silver Falcon (Tri-form Peacebringer)
Second Sun (Fire/Rad Controller)

Institution
Bitter Blizzard lvl 50 Corruptor
Taze lvl 17 Brute


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:31 pm 
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Hey X,

What is the purpose for this toon mate? PvE, PvP or both? If it's PvP who do you intend to fight against and who do you intend to avoid?

I wouldn't wanna waste your time with comments about issues which are irrelevant about the build.

_________________
@blastor-eu

The Intrepids:
Blastor-Level 50 Energy/Fire/Electrical Blaster, Dr. Blast-Level 50 Robotics/Force Field/Mace Mastermind, Holy Blast-Level 50 Peacebringer, Blasting Spines-Level 50 Spines/Regeneration/Body Scrapper, Heatblast-Level 50 Invulnerability/Fiery/Pyre Tanker, Fire Blast-Level 50 Fire/Kinetics/Leviathan Corruptor, Thunder Steel-Level 50 Ninja/Ninjitsu/Mu Stalker, Israfel the Fallen-Level 50 Sonic/Thermal/Dark Corruptor, Blastor Ascended-Level 50 Psychic/Energy/Force Blaster, Fright-Level 50 Kinetic/Dark Armour/Energy Brute, Calibro-Level 50 Dual Pistols/Radiation/Power Corruptor, Nlidia-Level 50 Gravity/Storm/Ice Controller.

The Institution:
Admiral Blast-Level 50 Energy/Energy/Mace Brute, Darkest Blast-Level 50 Mind/Psionic/Leviathan Dominator, Arbiter Blast-Level 50 Crab/Mace Arachnos Soldier, Unmerciful Steel-Level 50 Dual Blades/Willpower/Soul Brute, Mind Blaster-Level 50 Dark Miasma/Psychic/Psychic Defender, Blastor Reborn-Level 50 Ice/Electric/Force Blaster, Superiora-Level 50 Invulnerability/Super Strength/Energy Tanker, Gaia Queen-Level 50 Plant/Empathy/Stone Controller, Shadow Seer-Level 50 Fortunata/Soul Arachnos Widow, Zamana-Level 50 Time/Beam Rifle Defender, Wild Raven-Level 50 Will Power/Street Justice/Energy Tanker, Nlador-Level 50 Titan/Fiery Brute.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 4:27 pm 
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Errr ... check back 50 odd posts blast. It was in the first one. :wink:

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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 Post subject: Build Update 3rd Dec 2007
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 7:56 pm 
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Actually I've already thrown that old build out the window. :D

For several reasons but mainly because my inner voice kept shouting "No, No dude. NOOOO. Unsung is a regenerative fighting machine. He's got to be more foxy than stodgy."

Here's the official bio:

Designed as the ultimate 'dark' fighting machine. Gary Connor is the sole survivor of operation Osterich, an above-top-secret covert ops mission designed to elimate evidence of chemical and nuclear weapon systems development in Iraq BEFORE official US and United Nations forces found them! A sworn protector of the US's most highly confidential stealth, defence and advanced bio-technological weapons iniatives, Gary Connor is a one man, regenerative fighting system - the ultimate Unsung hero.

His mission: to go on protecting advanced US weapons iniatives worldwide.


That's just the official version. Unofficially, Unsung was partly built on alien stealth and regenerative technology culled from downed saucers from Roswell in '47 through to Doraty (Google it: Judy Doraty '80). Part of his nervous system has been replaced with reptilian DNA (alien) which accounts for his phenominal regenerative and perceptive abilities.

The reptilian part of Connor's DNA is also gradually taking over, making Conner the cruelest, coldest, most clinicaly destructive agent that the US has ever deployed in the field. Don't mess with this guy. He's a natural survivor.

Connor has no known family or associates and only dim memories of his former life and child-hood sweet-heart before the explosion in his last official tour ripped him limb from limb dropping him into a boiling vat of experimental compound X-3258-933.

So of course the previous build didn't even come close to delivering on that kind of background. In it's place is the following (please note use of advanced stealth technology, time/space teleportation and the ability to phase-out of the current human space/time continuum and drop into another dimension while his wounds heal. That last point should be particulary annoying in Person V Person combat. :shock:

01) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(1) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(25)
01) --> Fast Healing==> Heal(1) Heal(50) Heal(50)
02) --> Smite==> Acc(2) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(7) Dmg(23) Rechg(46)
04) --> Quick Recovery==> EndMod(4) EndMod(13) EndMod(15)
06) --> Touch of Fear==> Acc(6) Acc(31) TH_DeBuf(31) TH_DeBuf(37) TH_DeBuf(39) Rechg(43)
08 ) --> Shadow Maul==> Acc(8 ) Acc(9) Dmg(9) Dmg(11) Dmg(17) Rechg(37)
10) --> Siphon Life==> Acc(10) Acc(11) Heal(13) Heal(15) Heal(17) Rechg(19)
12) --> Hasten==> Rechg(12) Rechg(21) Rechg(21)
14) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Integration==> Heal(16) Heal(29) Heal(46)
18 ) --> Dark Consumption==> Acc(18 ) Acc(19) Rechg(25) Rechg(34) Rechg(40) EndMod(40)
20) --> Dull Pain==> Heal(20) Heal(23) Heal(29) Rechg(34) Rechg(34)
22) --> Stealth==> DefBuf(22) DefBuf(43) DefBuf(45)
24) --> Recall Friend==> IntRdx(24)
26) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(26) Acc(27) Rechg(27) Rechg(36) TH_Buf(36) TH_Buf(37)
28 ) --> Instant Healing==> Heal(28 ) Heal(31) Heal(39) Rechg(40) Rechg(43)
30) --> Teleport Foe==> Acc(30)
32) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(32) Acc(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(36) Rechg(39)
35) --> Grant Invisibility==> DefBuf(35)
38 ) --> Phase Shift==> Rechg(38 ) Rechg(46)
41) --> Focused Accuracy==> TH_Buf(41) TH_Buf(42) TH_Buf(42) EndRdx(42)
44) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg(44) Rechg(45) Rechg(45)
47) --> Moment Of Glory==> DmgRes(47) DmgRes(48 ) DmgRes(48 ) DefBuf(48 ) DefBuf(50)
49) --> Resilience==> DmgRes(49)

I also figure that by dropping the Fitness and Fighting pools (despite everything I said earlier) and nabbing Conserve Power then I should be just about alright for endurance. I'd forgotten how good Quick Recovery is all on it's own. I've already taked to Dark Consumption which already works great with just one acc slot on it. I went on Test and played around with Siphon Life to thoroughly test that too. Gotta say that it works great. With lvl 20 IO's on him I get a reliable enough 20% heal every 12 seconds (7 seconds with Hasten on) and it lands criticals and the extra acc debuff. I'll also use Phase Shift to protect my arse if MoG starts going down.

Of course, as another of Covert op soldiers (Covert was the first) Unsung will also be an expert field operative able to move both friends and foes around the map at will, and unseen.

Hmmm: wanders if I can grab 'unseen' as a title? The unseen Unsung would be quite nice. :D

I've also been stress testing DPS levels on all the stalker primaries. I'll be posting that up here very soon too.

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


Last edited by MrX on Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Build Update 3rd Dec 2007
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:01 pm 
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MrX wrote:

Hmmm: wanders if I can grab 'unseen' as a title? The unseen Unsung would be quite nice. :D


http://cityofheroes.wikia.com/wiki/Titles

dosent look like it X

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Angus(1), Mr Meccano(9), Hard Target(5), Big Zero(18), Anubis(9), Dummy(1)

CoH Globals: @MESS or @TRASH
Heroes
MESS (50) Tank

Villians
Tainted Mess (50) Brute, TRASH (50) Brute, Magmite (50) Brute, Smelt Furnace (50) Brute

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:12 am 
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Oooo. That's good link Mess. Unseen is there, but only for lvl 25+ natural origins and only villains. I didn't even know they were origin related. :shock:

Looks like it's going to have to Unnatural then. :D

_________________
[b]MrX Heroes: MrX Lvl 50 warshade. | MIND0R Lvl 50 mind/emp troll | The-Messenger Lvl 50 BS/regen scrap | Covert Lvl 42 kin/pys def | .Relic Lvl 42 illu/emp troll | Havoc Lvl 42 kin/elec def | The-Elemental Lvl 39 storm/dark def | Unsung Lvl 38 dark/regen scrap | WRENCH Lvl 34 shield/wrench tank | The Watcher Lvl 15 earth/rad troller | Villains: FR0STBITE Lvl 50 ice/kin corr | Dark-X Lvl 47 dark/stone brute | N'Ice Lvl 42 ice/rad corr | Vortex Lvl 42 robotics/storm MM | ShadowBaby Lvl 41 claws/regen stalk | The Cloak Lvl 41 energy/energy stalk | Thang Lvl 39 robotics/FF MM | IonFist Lvl 34 energy/ninjitsu stalk | The Somnabulist Lvl 33 dark/nec MM | Mr Kripplin Lvl 32 rad/rad corr | M0RBIUS Lvl 20 necro/poison MM | The Infrigidator Lvl 20 ice/cold corr


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